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How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?


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Posted on 13-06-10 18:47
Well Basically, I know how data is stored onto a hard drive (Physically and Electronically).

However, What is the difference between saving a Small Whole Number and a Very Large Whole Number?

I'm doing this for a college course assignment and it asks how the data is saved.

Thanks In Advance,
DarkMantis


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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?

ynori7
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Posted on 13-06-10 18:51
DarkMantis wrote:
However, What is the difference between saving a Small Whole Number and a Very Large Whole Number?

What do you mean? It really depends on the data type. An int is 32 bits whether it's equal to 2 or 20,000.


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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?


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Posted on 13-06-10 18:54
ynori7 wrote:
An int is 32 bits whether it's equal to 2 or 20,000.


I think that is what I wanted to know. The assignment doesn't make it very clear on what they want.

Thanks a bunch ynori7 Smile


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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?


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Posted on 13-06-10 19:35
DarkMantis wrote:
ynori7 wrote:
An int is 32 bits whether it's equal to 2 or 20,000.


I think that is what I wanted to know. The assignment doesn't make it very clear on what they want.

Thanks a bunch ynori7 Smile


Also look into little vs. big-endian byte ordering. they might want that covered as well. And, if pertinent, file systems.

Your question is impossibly vague. Pfft
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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?

AldarHawk
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Posted on 14-06-10 13:51
All data on a hard drive is stored in Binary (1's and 0's).

It is broken down into the binary comparison to the data you have. to make up examples just use a binary converter to get this information Pfft


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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?

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Posted on 15-06-10 06:10
True they use a magnetics charge to represent a binary digit later to be read as data


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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?


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Posted on 15-06-10 11:02
Something to do with magnets? Maybe they magnitise blocks of a ferromagnet and erm disrupt in in other regions? or magnatise is anti parrallel? Then read this as 1's and 0's?


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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?


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Posted on 15-06-10 11:13
There's no such thing as a "magnetic charge" (otherwise you'd have magnetic monopoles), but there are magnetic fields. The surface of a HD platter is doped with iron oxide molecules (rust, in other words), which are magnetic. Bits are encoded using the orientation of the field on the surface, which is directed either into surface or out from it (perpendicular recording), which is a recent change from the old, parallel recording:
images.techtree.com/ttimages/story/73524_perptech.jpg

Rather than simply using the direction to encode bits, bits are encoded as a change (for a 1) or lack of change (for a 0) in direction. In this scheme, a long sequence of 0s would be encoded as a long stretch with no change in field direction. If the sequence is too long, the read hardware might lose track of where it is in the sequence, dropping or adding 0s. There's also a limit on the number of possible transitions in a given space, which creates an upper limit on the density of information that's lower than what's possible in the average case. To fix these issues, hard disks us a run length limited encoding, which encodes k bits as n bits (with k < n), preventing too many sequential 0s or 1s (see also the older MFM encoding). You find the same problem in optical media, which uses an 8 to 14 encoding. The data goes through additional encoding for error detection and correction, such as Reed-Solomon error correction.

All of this information is quite public. A few Google searches would have turned it up.
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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?


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Posted on 15-06-10 14:24
No one knows if magnetic monopoles exist. There's nothing to say they can't.
And mate please just post links to your source rather than chewing it up and spitting out incomprehensible gibberish.




Edited by on 15-06-10 14:26
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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?

AldarHawk
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Posted on 15-06-10 15:26
That explains the standard disk media. How about Flash Drives, USB Keys, 3D Hard Drives, Solid State...

You forget that the old mechanical hard drive is not the only way of recording information.


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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?


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Posted on 15-06-10 17:49
AldarHawk wrote:
You forget that the old mechanical hard drive is not the only way of recording information.


True, but the OP was about hard drives.

There are good resources out there on youtube for how NAND flash works in flash drives. I know there's a series of videos made by a forensic investigator on youtube that explains everything up from how each flash cell works.


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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?


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Posted on 15-06-10 18:03
NAND uses tunneling to store charge inside insulated ball. It might be the other one though not NAND. I forget what it's called. Also that's fairly simplified




Edited by on 15-06-10 18:06
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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?

AldarHawk
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Posted on 16-06-10 14:05
mattseanbachman wrote:
True, but the OP was about hard drives.


What do you think a SSD is? it is not a floppy disk Pfft


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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?


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Posted on 16-06-10 20:06
AldarHawk wrote:
mattseanbachman wrote:
True, but the OP was about hard drives.


What do you think a SSD is? it is not a floppy disk Pfft


I'm not trying to split hairs here but:

http://en.wikiped. . .disk_drive


Again about what I was talking about before, this dude covers solid-state and mag. media more in depth than most care to know about. It's from a forensic angle though, so most of the material is in that light, and the speaker can be a bit slow to get started:

http://www.youtub. . .yFlippingA






Edited by on 16-06-10 20:11
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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?


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Posted on 17-06-10 07:05
wolfmankurd wrote:
No one knows if magnetic monopoles exist.

That's true.

wolfmankurd wrote:
There's nothing to say they can't.

Some theories say they can't, and some say they can.


wolfmankurd wrote:
And mate please just post links to your source rather than chewing it up and spitting out incomprehensible gibberish.

I'm fairly certain I included links. Perhaps your browser is broken.

If you think what I wrote was gibberish, you need to go back to school.

Edited by on 17-06-10 07:05
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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?


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Posted on 17-06-10 16:23
I may be paraphrasing but:
n bits is encoded as k bits where k<n


That's called compression.
There are three reasons to put it like that, and all pointless.

1. k and n have a specific meaning. But in a thread about how hard drive work it'd make sense to point these out. I doubt this as k and n are fairly generic, almost foo and bar of the maths world.

2. You copied this directecly from a source taking it out of context.

3. You want to sound smarter than you are.

I suspect it's a mixture of 2 and 3.

This is backed up by your stupid reply about monopoles (do I think they exist? idk i have no clue, and I suspect you have even less of a clue). But I actually cannot think of a theory where they cannot exist, I know of a few which do not need their existance but could accommodate them. Can you use your wonderful linking abilities to point me to one?




Edited by on 17-06-10 16:28
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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?


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Posted on 17-06-10 17:11
young blood outis confronts a grizzled veteran wolfmankurd. A wild-west showdown for the 21st century...but who will win and claim the title of leet forum sheriff? Smile




Edited by on 17-06-10 17:13
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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?


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Posted on 17-06-10 17:33
mattseanbachman wrote:
young blood outis confronts a grizzled veteran wolfmankurd. A wild-west showdown for the 21st century...but who will win and claim the title of leet forum sheriff? Smile

Hear hear! Place your bets people, community points only, no cash or other valuables. Dignity accepted where needed.

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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?

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Posted on 17-06-10 19:30
mattseanbachman wrote:
I'm not trying to split hairs here but:
http://en.wikiped. . .disk_drive

See but you are splitting hairs when you bring that into play. With new technologies advancing as they are SSD is becoming more standard. A standard "Hard Drive Disk" being the standard magnetized platter set using mechanics is great. However, SSD are in the state of being called a "Hard Drive" now a days in many laptops. True it is not a conventional HDD (in the old term of Hard Drive), however it is still being used as such. I am not talking the Flash Drives or any other of these types of items. I am talking about the items like Samsungs SSD (http://www.comput. . .tebook_SSD for some reading on them Pfft)

I hope you understand this is coming from one who does know what he is talking about. I have been computing for longer than most users on this site are old. I have been hacking for longer than most users on here are old. However, I do not claim to know everything. I am in no means a genius hacker or anything. I just know what I am talking about when it comes to these types of things Wink

Anyways, I hope no one is taking any of this the wrong way (as many here do). Also, those who do actually know me will vouch to what I say :evil:
Anyways...I babble and digress...back to line...who wants to chirp up next?

P.S. Wolf will win :matey:


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RE: How is Data stored on a Hard Drive?


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Posted on 17-06-10 20:30
AldarHawk wrote:
mattseanbachman wrote:
I'm not trying to split hairs here but:
http://en.wikiped. . .disk_drive

See but you are splitting hairs when you bring that into play. With new technologies advancing as they are SSD is becoming more standard. A standard "Hard Drive Disk" being the standard magnetized platter set using mechanics is great. However, SSD are in the state of being called a "Hard Drive" now a days in many laptops. True it is not a conventional HDD (in the old term of Hard Drive), however it is still being used as such. I am not talking the Flash Drives or any other of these types of items. I am talking about the items like Samsungs SSD (http://www.comput. . .tebook_SSD for some reading on them Pfft)

(snipped)




Most of what you say is true, and yet I still disagree. What you posted makes a crucial distinction of differentiating between SSDs and hard drives.

Why is that? Because the colloquial use of the word connotes spinning magnetic media. Now, if you want to say that in your definition, "hard drive" includes SSDs, then just call everything a hard drive and drop the distinction. You've already made the claim that SSDs are a type of hard drive so why differentiate the two in subsequent posts? My inclination is that you recognize that there's an important distinction between the two.

So I see your point better now, but I still think when most people say "hard drive" they are talking about magnetic media, spinning disks, i.e. hard disk drives, and not SSDs. But this is a minor quibble about the definition of the word and as such I'll leave it at that.

And you're wrong to read into what I said as downplaying your overall abilities and/or aptitude with computers in general. I merely disagreed with you on this one issue, nothing more. Smile


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