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RE: Police Hacking Home Networks |
nights_shadow
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Skunkfoot wrote:
Maybe it's just me, but isn't it sort of wrong to try to prevent cops from hacking? I mean, anyone should be able to hack, regardless of what job they have (if any).
If you're concerned about the cops hacking your shit, then just make sure it's secure and don't worry about it.
No, absolutely not.
Also, for the bold part, this was the original point of this topic.
Edit: Let me elaborate a little bit on "No, absolutely not."
A cop, as a person, can hack as long as they follow the same rules the rest of us have to follow. If they are to disobey this rule, they must have it cleared by a court and provide sufficient evidence and proof as to why they want to hack into this computer. Otherwise it's just another case of abusive power.
Edited by nights_shadow on 08-01-09 21:01 |
  
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RE: Police Hacking Home Networks |
Skunkfoot
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No...look, a cop is a person. People should be allowed to hack if they want to. You can't expect them to get rid of any of those annoying laws if you sit here and complain that you don't like it when you get hacked.
I don't understand why you think cops need to follow hacking rules considering that hackers don't have a universal set of rules. Hackers follow their personal rules, that's all. Why should cops be any different?
How about this, don't think about them as "cops". You think that and you start to think about authority and power and all of those illusions and you start to tell yourself that cops shouldn't be allowed to hack when the truth is that everyone should be allowed to hack. Make sense?
Today a young man on acid realized that all matter is merely energy condensed to a slow vibration, that we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively, that there is no such thing as death, life is only a dream, and we are the imaginations of ourselves.
--Bill Hicks
--=[ Skunkfoot || Temet Nosce ]=--
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RE: Police Hacking Home Networks |
Skunkfoot
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Are you telling me that you think we, as hackers, shouldn't hack into other networks because we don't have permission? Cause you're saying that police shouldn't hack into other networks because they don't have a warrant, which is really just permission from a higher-ranking official.
Today a young man on acid realized that all matter is merely energy condensed to a slow vibration, that we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively, that there is no such thing as death, life is only a dream, and we are the imaginations of ourselves.
--Bill Hicks
--=[ Skunkfoot || Temet Nosce ]=--
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RE: Police Hacking Home Networks |
Skunkfoot
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Are you telling me that you think we, as hackers, shouldn't hack into other networks because we don't have permission? Cause you're saying that police shouldn't hack into other networks because they don't have a warrant, which is really just permission from a higher-ranking official.
Today a young man on acid realized that all matter is merely energy condensed to a slow vibration, that we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively, that there is no such thing as death, life is only a dream, and we are the imaginations of ourselves.
--Bill Hicks
--=[ Skunkfoot || Temet Nosce ]=--
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RE: Police Hacking Home Networks |
Skunkfoot
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moshbat wrote:
Skunkfoot wrote:
Are you telling me that you think we, as hackers, shouldn't hack into other networks because we don't have permission?
Legally, yes.
Either way, I believe that permission should be granted.
However, where permission is not granted, there should be some form of punishment.
So if it's illegal, you won't do it, and if by some miracle you do in fact do something illegal, you want to be punished for it? You think we should be punished for being curious?
That's fine if you think that, but I don't. 
Today a young man on acid realized that all matter is merely energy condensed to a slow vibration, that we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively, that there is no such thing as death, life is only a dream, and we are the imaginations of ourselves.
--Bill Hicks
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RE: Police Hacking Home Networks |
nights_shadow
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Skunkfoot wrote:
moshbat wrote:
Skunkfoot wrote:
Are you telling me that you think we, as hackers, shouldn't hack into other networks because we don't have permission?
Legally, yes.
Either way, I believe that permission should be granted.
However, where permission is not granted, there should be some form of punishment.
So if it's illegal, you won't do it, and if by some miracle you do in fact do something illegal, you want to be punished for it? You think we should be punished for being curious?
That's fine if you think that, but I don't.
No, that is not what I'm trying to say. Moshbat tried to convey what I wanted to say. If you break into a network it is ILLEGAL! (unless permission is given). To make it legal, without some third party, just because you are a part of law enforcement is giving them way too much power.
What we do may be of curiosity but a cops' job is to gain a conviction, not to learn and discover.
What you and me may do behind our monitors has nothing to do with this. If we do something illegal, we could get caught and arrested.
I don't know if you think that this will help those who break into computer systems. If you think that, just look at what else cops can do that civilians can't.
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RE: Police Hacking Home Networks |
Skunkfoot
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To make it legal, without some third party, just because you are a part of law enforcement is giving them way too much power.
As I understood it, they aren't so much making something legal as they are breaking a law that should have never been created in the first place.
I'm just trying to understand where you're coming from here. You're saying that it's wrong that the cops aren't being arrested and prosecuted for doing things that a normal citizen would be arrested and prosecuted for doing?
I can understand that. I don't think we should be prosecuted for any information they might find though. In the U.S.A we have an amendment to protect against unreasonable searches and seizures, I think it's the 4th. It says something like "blah blah you can't search someone's house without a warrant and you can't get a warrant without probable cause. If you do manage to get a warrant, you can only collect evidence if it is listed in the warrant (specifically describing the places to be searched and the objects/people to be seized or something like that)"
However, and I'm pretty sure someone mentioned this early on, but we also have the Patriot Act, which does something in the nature of taking away all of a person's rights if the government has reason to believe that they're a terrorist (or something like that...)
All I was saying is that I don't think anyone should be arrested and prosecuted for doing what the police are doing in this situation. If you want to keep something private, you can always encrypt it or hide it or whatever.
Today a young man on acid realized that all matter is merely energy condensed to a slow vibration, that we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively, that there is no such thing as death, life is only a dream, and we are the imaginations of ourselves.
--Bill Hicks
--=[ Skunkfoot || Temet Nosce ]=--
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RE: Police Hacking Home Networks |
rex_mundi
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Here in the UK we have a facility know as "RAF Menwith Hill", this base is considered to be American soil , and is run by the NSA , and is therefore exempt from UK law .
This facility is the largest electronic monitoring station anywhere in the world , and is a main part of the ECHELON system .
When it was still considered a big no-no to spy on your own citizens , the UK , US , Australia , Canada and New Zealand , formed a pact that allowed the creation of bases on their own soil to do exactly that , but outsourced the running of them to each other , to bypass the laws of the land .
While it was always deemed illegal for a government to collect that information personally on its own citizens , it was not deemed illegal to act on it , if it was passed to you by a third party .
As Moshbat said before :
Who the fuck thinks privacy still exists?
Who the fuck thinks that this doesn't already happen?
Who the fuck thinks that what you do on the internet isn't being watched?
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RE: Police Hacking Home Networks |
chronicburst
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You have the Main portion of Project ECHELON around you? No offense but that is almost a good thing. So many things going into that facility they cant keep track of the small stuff like this... But I don't know how small they may think it is.
As for me, I have several Project ECHELON facilities near me, more of a worry in my care because they are smaller facilities so they know whats up.
Wonder exactly how that works. So much must be filtered... For example... Not this haha.
I feel windows is so common that no matter who has it, their being watched. I would never exploit from a windows box. Backtrack on that mater, believe the NSA can agree with me on that one.
If you know about interesting about ECHELON though, please share. And I don't mean a link to Wikipedia, I got that covered, just maybe any other interesting facts or conspiracy's.
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RE: Police Hacking Home Networks |
rex_mundi
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www.bibliotecapleyades.net/ciencia/echelon/echelon_index.htm#menu
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Edited by rex_mundi on 09-01-09 11:17 |
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